#005: Histamine Part 2

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Intro  0:03

Welcome to the Health Babes Podcast with Drs. Becky Campbell and Krystal Hohn, where we talk everything health.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 0:13

We’re kind of matchy-matchy today.

Dr. Becky Campbell 0:13

So far, I look like a pilgrim.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 0:17

You’re cute. You’re my little pilgrim. [laughs]

Dr. Becky Campbell 0:22

Okay, we were trying to do different episodes. So we posted a graphic called “Spill It.” What we really want is for you guys to ask us fun questions because that’s just our personalities, and we want to share all of that with you. But everyone is asking about histamine because that’s what most people who follow me at the time are struggling with. So we’re going to do a histamine part two [podcast] because we covered histamine in our last episode, and now we’re going to answer some actual questions that you guys posted on histamine intolerance. And I’m fine with that.

Dr. Becky Campbell 1:05

But we just want to let you guys know that this podcast is not just about histamine intolerance; it’s about all types of issues. So we also want to know more about what you want to hear about other than histamine. So from Instagram, the first question I think is pretty relevant is [from] Loving_Him7. Well, I wonder who he is, but he’s lucky.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 1:27


Dr. Becky Campbell 1:27

[inaudible] after him. Okay, so she asked, “How can you determine if you have histamine intolerance versus mast cell activation syndrome?” That is a great question.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 1:40

It is, and we get it a lot in practice.

Dr. Becky Campbell 1:42

A lot. Here’s the thing: I believe, and I know many practitioners believe, that mast cell activation syndrome is the root cause of most histamine intolerance. Mast cells are white blood cells that release histamine. So when we have a pathogen, a foreign invader, come into the body, like a virus or whatever, our body releases histamine from our mast cells, which causes an inflammatory response that allows our immune system to go in and do its job of getting to that pathogen. The thing with mast cell activation syndrome is that it will happen when there is no pathogen. But you may be too cold, and your mast cells are going to dump—it’s called degranulation—a bunch of histamine. You may be too hot, and that’s going to happen. You may be stressed, which I see as a huge thing [inaudible].

Dr. Krystal Hohn 2:40

A big driver.

Dr. Becky Campbell 2:42

Yes. So it’s more of an abnormal release of histamine, if you will, rather than just your body’s immune system responding to a pathogen. So mast cell activation syndrome is when you’re dumping histamine for various reasons. There are about 50 triggers, if not more, for mast cell activation syndrome. But many people have it, and the only reason that people are finding out that they have it is because no one really knew about it before, so it just started to get talked about.

Dr. Becky Campbell 3:16

It’s that person who goes to their doctor and has a laundry list of symptoms, none of which make sense, and nothing is working. That’s usually mast cell activation syndrome. So that is the difference. And you can have histamine intolerance without having mast cell activation syndrome. I see that that tends to happen with people who have gut issues. Maybe in their 30s, they just got a parasite, H. pylori, Candida, or whatever, or bacterial dysbiosis, and that is reducing the enzyme that breaks down histamine. Plus, that bacteria is actually creating more histamine that your body is having trouble breaking down, or you’re having a hormonal imbalance. Estrogen is a really big driver of histamine. So the more estrogen we have, the more histamine we release.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 4:08

Good old estrogen, right?

Dr. Becky Campbell 4:09

Good old estrogen.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 4:11

Good old estrogen! And with mast cell [activation], it’s not just histamine, right? There are other chemicals involved too, right?

Dr. Becky Campbell 4:19

Oh yes. Inflammatory chemicals. And this is kind of going to lead me to the next question, which is very important. So, okay, so Carly Marineart… She asked, “How can people with histamine intolerance support their bodies when they get COVID?” I am working on a full-blown guide on this for you guys.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 4:51


Dr. Becky Campbell 4:52

The 17 things I’m working on right now. So what happens is that mast cells release a lot of inflammatory chemicals. When you have COVID, you get into what’s called a cytokine storm. That is creating this inflammatory process. It’s overwhelming for the body. A lot of people are ending up with post-COVID syndrome. In post-COVID syndrome, they are actually finding that they are histamine intolerant, if not developing mast cell activation syndrome. So what you want to do, and I’ve written an article, it’s on DrBeckyCampbell.com—

Dr. Krystal Hohn 5:30

It’s a good article!

Dr. Becky Campbell 5:31

And we’ll put it in the show notes. But I am expanding on that right now and actually creating a full book on it. But what you want to do is actually start following a low-histamine diet. And if you’re already high in histamine because you’ve had this cytokine storm post-COVID or from COVID, you want to reduce the high-histamine foods because they’re going to cause more inflammation. So those are going to be fermented foods, aged foods, and dried fruits. It’s going to be [inaudible].

Dr. Krystal Hohn 6:04

All the best foods.

Dr. Becky Campbell 6:06

Yes, everything we like. Strawberries, avocado,charcuterie boards… But I’m going to teach you guys, when this is out, how to get this to not be an issue for your whole life. So for now, I have my Histamine Reset Plan, and we’re actually giving away two of these today. So we’re going to give them away to the two best reviews. But you just follow the plan in the book. You support the liver. You take out the highest histamine foods. There are certain nutrients that you need. You can take supplements like quercitin, which most people tolerate really well, but it’s a very good anti-histamine supplement. So be careful with the probiotics you’re taking because a lot of the products contain histamine-producing bacteria, which we don’t want.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 6:55

We work a lot with Probiota HistaminX, which is really good at lowering histamine levels.

Dr. Becky Campbell 7:00

Right, and that’s from Seeking Health. We use that in MegaSpore. We like those a lot.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 7:04

A lot. Spore-forming. Lactic acid-forming.

Dr. Becky Campbell 7:08

So that’s kind of the shortened version, but the book gives you an entire plan on what to do. And at the very least, read the article.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 7:18

Mm-hmm. There’s another one. This is from Loving_Him7. “How do you determine if you have histamine intolerance versus mast cell [activation]?”

Dr. Becky Campbell 7:28

That’s the one I answered.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 7:29

Oh, okay. Well, I think he’s asking more so testing too.

Dr. Becky Campbell 7:34

Okay. So there are blood tests and [inaudible] tests for mast cell activation syndrome, but they’re not always accurate. And they have to go to these different labs. I mean, it’s a process. I don’t test for it anymore. I kind of just know because I have it and I know what to look for. For me, it’s like I’ve always had issues. I got migraines when I was little. I passed out in the heat when I was little. I got random hives when I was little. That’s not stuff that doesn’t really happen if you don’t have mast cell activation.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 8:07

Right, exactly. Yes.

Dr. Becky Campbell 8:11

But I think that there was actually another one. So it’s Nico Rostum. “Is there a link between histamine intolerance and the liver?” And [inaudible], which is why we support the liver with everything.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 8:23

With everything! It’s so important, especially for our genetics and how we detox, to support that. So we work a lot with the liver, right? Supporting the liver is so important, especially for histamine.

Dr. Becky Campbell 8:36

Yes. So we use Liver Love, which is our product that we love, and most people do really well with it!

Dr. Krystal Hohn 8:44

They really do, yes!

Dr. Becky Campbell 8:46

But if you don’t like taking supplements, there are other ways to do it. There are castor oil packs. You can put those over your liver. There are Epsom salt baths, if you can tolerate that. You want to start off really slow. I say start off with about half a cup of Epsom salt, and you can work your way up to about three cups. There are also infrared saunas. Ooh, maybe Chris will let me post the picture of her in her infrared sauna.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 9:11

Yes! The tent sauna with my head sticking out.

Dr. Becky Campbell 9:15

Yes, we’ll post that for you guys. You’re welcome in advance.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 9:18

It’s a goodie!

Dr. Becky Campbell 9:19

And it’s low in EMFs too.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 9:22

It is. It’s low in EMFs. And you just want to start slower, especially if you do have histamine intolerance. Be careful with that, right? So start slow, depending on where you’re at with that. But it’s so good for detox and liver support, opening up those detox pathways, especially as you’re working on so many things in the body, whether you’re working on inflammation, histamine, or hormones. It’s important to incorporate these gentle detoxes into our day.

Dr. Becky Campbell 9:51

So if you have any skin issues—this is a little side note—like, let’s say, eczema all over your body, I would not recommend an infrared sauna or dry brushing. If your liver isn’t working right, your body has your skin to detox. So that’s the whole purpose behind dry brushing. But again, if you have skin issues, those are the two [things] I would not use, so the supplement would be a lot better for you. And even an Epsom salt bath could be inflammatory, so I would definitely do the supplement.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 10:21

It can. Your own individual health experiences and the symptoms you’re experiencing—you have to take all of that into consideration when choosing these different things. And let your health practitioner help and guide you in that, right? It’s so important.

Dr. Becky Campbell 10:38

Yes. So what we do with histamine intolerance in our practice is first support the liver and histamine [balance] with our HistoRelief supplement, and then we do some testing. We look at gut health because that plays a very big role. We look at hormone responses, whether it’s sex hormones, thyroid hormones, adrenal hormones, or some other things that can be driving this. So we do all that. And then we really personalize the protocol for everybody. It really depends on the person.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 11:12

It really does depend on the person. And we have some patients too who are really sensitive. And you have to start things off really slowly, like supporting their detox—supporting things slowly.

Dr. Becky Campbell 11:25

Definitely, yes. [inaudible] detox protocol. So that is kind of the second part of histamine intolerance. We’ll talk more about it in the future because, obviously, it’s one of my passions since I’ve struggled with it, but I don’t really [struggle with it] anymore. So that’s why I work so hard to help people with it. But we really do want to hear from you guys about other topics too, and [we want to know] what you want to hear about.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 11:53

Especially the “Spill it”. Give us all the [inaudible]. We want this to be fun. Of course, it’s a health podcast. We’re going to be interviewing so many experts on different things, talking about all different types of health topics, but we also want it to be fun too. We’re all people; we all have human experiences, and we want to talk about everything, right?

Dr. Becky Campbell 12:14

Ask us anything.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 12:17

Yes! It’s what makes it fun. We don’t want to be boring, right?

Dr. Becky Campbell 12:22

So don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast—we would really appreciate that—and don’t forget to leave reviews. In every episode, we give out prizes for reviews. We pick the two best reviews. This week, it’s going to be this book, The 4-Phase Histamine Reset Plan. I will sign it and mail it to you myself. And then don’t forget to follow us on Instagram at @HealthBabesPodcast, @DrBeckyCampbell, and @DrKrystalHohn. And then don’t forget to watch us on our YouTube channel. Right now we’re doing it on mine, which is ‘Dr. Becky Campbell’. Eventually, we’ll also have a Health Babes podcast.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 13:01

Yes. We’re working on that. It’s been a labor of love getting a podcast together. Has it not?

Dr. Becky Campbell 13:06

It’s a lot.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 13:07

It’s a lot. But it’s fun. Thanks for growing and learning with us. So we’re excited about the future, but holy bananas! This has been a… It really has.

Dr. Becky Campbell 13:21

Can I just say something about Krystal? Krystal is literally like the girl next door, and I’m not kidding. You know, a lot of people fake that in this industry. Krystal is for real. Krystal will say things like ‘Holy bananas!’ and Krystal will spell out… Like, one day we were talking, and she was like, I’m such a D-O-R-K. And I’m like, Krystal, that’s not even… Like, you can say that word. She’s so funny. And there’s something that she always says, and I want you to pay attention to this. She always says, “I’m so serious!” Just like that. So every time she says that, you need to do something, whether it’s… 

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:08

Take a shot.

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:09

It’s a drinking game… But you know, I don’t know, do a push-up or, you know…

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:12

Do something more healthy. Take a shot of… tea.

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:16

[inaudible] but most of our listeners have high histamine.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:19

Yes. Oh, my gosh, I love you. Thank you.

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:20

[inaudible] and I say, yeah! So you can count, and you can let us know if she said that a lot.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:31

I know, I know. Dylan, her boyfriend, actually made this video of me. He recorded me saying, “I’m so serious!” It was so cute.

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:41

[inaudible] the Prince of Bel Air.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:45

He’s like, “You guys need to use this as your closing.”

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:48

It’s not for copyright purposes, but it’s really funny.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 14:52

Right, exactly. It was funny. He’s a sweetie.

Dr. Becky Campbell 14:57

Yes, he’s funny. So we thank you, guys, for listening.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 15:00

Yes. Thank you so much! Have a good weekend. It’s Friday here today, so…

Dr. Becky Campbell 15:05

Friday is here for us, but maybe it’s Monday for you.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 15:09

Exactly, exactly. And I love you, and I’ll see you [on the] next episode, Beck!

Dr. Becky Campbell 15:14

Okay, bye, guys.

Dr. Krystal Hohn 15:16